K1200RS UPSHIFTING Problem - K-Bikes.com - Excellence in Motion
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post #1 of 12 (permalink) Old May 15th, 2006, 10:12 pm Thread Starter
 
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K1200RS UPSHIFTING Problem

I just purchased a 2002 K1200RS with 6900 miles on it. The bike is great - very smooth and very fast (a lot faster then my old K75S LOL). In a few hundred miles I have had an issue with UP shifting from 2nd to 3rd. Down shifting has never been a problem. Shifting in general works just fine except for the 3 occassions. The bike was not ridden a lot before I purchased it and the oild was just changed in the gear box. I had to shift to neutral and then back in to 2nd a few times and then it allowed me to go to 3rd. I have only put a few hundren miles on it at this point. I have seen the posts regarding the spline issue and down shifting but don't have any problems with downshifing. Any ideas as to what is causing this and what I can do to solve the issue?
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post #2 of 12 (permalink) Old May 16th, 2006, 12:53 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulK1200RS
In a few hundred miles I have had an issue with UP shifting from 2nd to 3rd. Down shifting has never been a problem. Shifting in general works just fine except for the 3 occassions.
Keep on riding and see if you can note some sort of pattern to the shifting problem or some condition that makes the transmission behave in the manner you describe. Mine occasionally balks at shifting into 2nd when it's not fully warmed up, and that's the only oddity I've ever noticed.

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post #3 of 12 (permalink) Old May 16th, 2006, 1:47 pm
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulK1200RS
I just purchased a 2002 K1200RS with 6900 miles on it. The bike is great - very smooth and very fast (a lot faster then my old K75S LOL). In a few hundred miles I have had an issue with UP shifting from 2nd to 3rd. Down shifting has never been a problem. Shifting in general works just fine except for the 3 occassions. The bike was not ridden a lot before I purchased it and the oild was just changed in the gear box. I had to shift to neutral and then back in to 2nd a few times and then it allowed me to go to 3rd. I have only put a few hundren miles on it at this point. I have seen the posts regarding the spline issue and down shifting but don't have any problems with downshifing. Any ideas as to what is causing this and what I can do to solve the issue?
Suggest you try to "pre-load" the shift lever more deliberately prior to pulling the clutch. But, I came off a K75 too and don't remember a lot of difference in the shifting. Anyway, pre-loading is a good technique for smooth upshifts with no false neutrals.
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post #4 of 12 (permalink) Old May 16th, 2006, 3:28 pm
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i changed to preloading and its like night and day!...and i hear that the bmw is made for that...soooo much smoother...
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post #5 of 12 (permalink) Old May 16th, 2006, 6:23 pm
 
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upshifting problem

Make sure you let the shift lever return to normal position (go back down) after an up shift. When I first got my 2003 K1200RS I experienced an inability to go to 3rd at times. I wasn't letting the lever return to mid point or normal to pick up next gear. Operator error on my part.
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post #6 of 12 (permalink) Old May 17th, 2006, 9:41 am
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My 03 GT with 3200 miles is very hard and clunkyer on upshifts as compared to my other bikes but I can shift it without the clutch much smoother than with the clutch. My girl friend can't even notice the shift when I power shift it. I can't believe the shift is so smooth when power shifting. It just slips right in the the next gear with so little effort. Clutch shifting is very clunky by comparision. I don't understand that and it bothers me that something may be wrong. My buddys RS is a little smoother than mine when using the clutch and his power shifts just like mine. Mine is so clunky........ I power shift it every time above second gear. I CAN do a first to second, but I get neutral too many times so I use the clutch on that one. I hear that the spline clutch disc could be a problem. How is that contributing to hard shifting?

Also I notice hard down shifting all the time. When I say hard shifting I mean it takes more effort than what I am accustomed to on others bikes and there is a vagueness to the the feel of the shifter. I start to apply downward pressure to the shifter and I can feel it start to move with some resistance, like it's binding a little, then with increasing pressure it finally makes the shift. It gets better when the bike warms up, but the quality of shift is nothing like other bikes I have. I'm not pressing really hard to accoplish a shift......it's just more than what I feel should be nessarry.
Any more info on the potienal clutch disc spline issue would be appreciated.

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post #7 of 12 (permalink) Old May 17th, 2006, 11:03 am
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Hopefully you were not allowing the shift lever to completely return to the middle (common occurrence); otherwise it's not normal. Try removing your boot from the shift lever completely, and see if that happens again.

My problem, still happening at 12K miles, is the shift from 1 to 2nd, but when HOT. I still have to be VERY deliberate with the shift, but sometimes it just refuses to click 2nd, as hard as I try. I don't like that at all, but it goes away. That happens when the engine has been cycling the fans due to traffic. When cold, it shifts perfectly. And never a problem donwshifting, or upshifting other than 1-2. The problem obviously is thermal expansion, and since I ride just for fun, I might have the equivalent of 2K miles on the bike, since I might travel over 100 miles for every 1-2 shift I make. Who knows. ANy guesses? WHAT'S CAUSING NOT TO HIT 2ND FROM THE 1-2 SHIFT??? Just curious.

Oh, and this thing is practically impossible to shift smoothly, even after 12K miles. I shift my other (Japanese) bikes like a pro since day 1, and most of them with hydraulic clutches as well. Could it be the stupid dry clutch? Maybe, but it's frustrating. Take care.
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post #8 of 12 (permalink) Old May 17th, 2006, 1:52 pm
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i found that lubing your shift likage helps alot...gets dry and because of the way its set up it dosent take that much to have it work hard....just a little spray of pb blaster
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post #9 of 12 (permalink) Old Jun 19th, 2006, 8:26 pm Thread Starter
 
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A little Up date....

Well, I have tried everything. I was convinced that it was "operator error" as suggested before but that is not the case. It is a problem in the bike - probably due to lack of lubrication between the input shaft and the clutch plate. The BMW dealer I go to tells me that the clutch plate needs to float freely on the input shaft. It seems that BMW Germany put a paste-type grease on when the bike was built. Maybe this paste has dried up or is close to it . BMW USA stocks a grease that is more like Vaseline - much lower viscosity. The problem is the cost to access the shaft since there is not a maintenance port. The trany to engine joint is totally sealed up. I am looking at about maybe 8 hours to split the two apart, lube the clutch and put it back together (this actually is the "clutch replacement time" he quoted me but it would probably not be much less then this).

I can see why if the clutch plate does not slide freely it would continue to drive the transmission. This loading up is causing the shift issue. I have tried power shifting and it does work nice but it goes against my "mechanical religion" to power shift. I want the clutch to wear not the transmission.
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post #10 of 12 (permalink) Old Jun 19th, 2006, 8:35 pm
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There was much discussion on this in the R11xx forums. It was called a spline lube. I ended up doing this a couple of times. There is a couple methods to do this. One was to disassemble the entire rear end of the bike, do the lube and put it all back together again.

At one of the tech events a few of us determined that if you remove few of the components and wires holding the rear of the bike on and replace the bolts holding the transmission to the engine with much longer bolts, you are able slide the transmission back about 3 to 3.5 inches, inspect the spline and lube the spline. When you are done you slide the transmission back onto the engine, put back the orginal bolts, torque them correctly and then reverse the assembly process.

I have left out a bunch of detail but this is the high concept.

Howard

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