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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
I picked up the K13S on Apr 23rd and it runs beautifully. Have over 1200mi on it.

The only issue has occurred since 600mi about 6 times total... that is while downshifting and slowing down preparing to come to stop, the engine just "quietly" without notice shuts off, always while in 2nd or 3rd and under 30mph. Fuel level unrelated as it has done with full or partial tank of fuel.

No, I'm not forgetting to pull the clutch in soon enough. These incidents have been occurring once or twice at 180-mile intervals.

I know there have been similar experiences on late R's and even a few F's and one area dealership stated the problem has been actuators which control the butterflies not returning to normal operating positions, thus a stall while riding along or rough idling. The bike has no idling issues. BTW, the bike always starts immediately after it quits and runs fine after that.

So have any of you new K13 owners had the same problem(s)?

Thanks for any input. Have notified the dealer, but no response yet.
 

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Sure it isn't the switchgear? Seems to be an issue with the 1300's. Is it slowing shutting down like a lawnmower running out of gas, or is it immediate (electrical)?


Mack
 

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Several K1300S owners from the "other" forum, including myself, have this malady. It's not a big deal, but annoying nonetheless. Mine started after a couple thousand miles. I'm gonna monitor it and talk to the dealer. Keep us posted as to what your dealer says.
 
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Discussion Starter #4
The engine just shuts down immediately. But it is kind of "sneaky" since no lights show up on panel as would on a car/other bikes when you have ignition on but no motor running. And there is no alert that it's going to shut off... sometimes happens in the worst of situations like in traffic as your downshifting coming up to stopped traffic in front of you, or ready to make a turn!!!

Switchgear?? You mean the left-side new universal controls? If that isn't being "touched" why would motor cut off? So far it has not happened when I engaged turn signal... I think, but can't be certain it didn't happen one time.

Keep suggestions coming, and thanks.
 
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Discussion Starter #5
OK, here's what I've found out through an aftermarket supplier of K-bike accessories, S's in particular. The owner (has K1200S) and manager (also owns BMW and others) deal a lot with recent purchasers of the new K1300S who want stuff for their new bikes.

This month alone they have had 3 owners of K1300S's (I'm #3) who have the EXACT same issue my bike is having. And store manager said it is absolutely a computer issue! Told me to call BMW direct and ask them to "make a case" so a recall process can be put into action, as very few dealers and techs (who were trained primarily as R technicians) know what is going on with the K's.

I'm calling BMW tomorrow to tell them exactly what is happening, and tell them I want BMW to "make a case" on this bike. Those are the key words I was told to use when contacting BMW. Apparently the K12's computer was far worse than this but the K13's still need a new code written to take care of problem.

At any rate, computer issue or not, I'm lodging a complaint and case directly with BMW.
 

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Had the same thing happen to me. Same situation, coming to a stop, clutch in, downshifting then silence. Started right back up. Only happened to me once so far, but if you go to the BMW Superbikes.com forum several people there have had the same thing happen. I called BMW NA and spoke to Thomas ex:8849 , who of course said they haven't heard of this before. I posted for everyone to call in and report the problem, but we'll see what happens. I'm not sure anything has been done yet. So please call in and let them know it happened to you too. I have since been trying to get the bike to do it again, but it won't, and I hope it never does again, but I am not that foolish!
 

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Does you're bike have a quicker shifter, if it does it's possible that there is a relationship between QS and you’re problem. As you know the quick shifter QS cut the motor momentarily between shifts. It is possible when shifting you are getting a bounce switch bounce from the QS the computers stop the motor cause it does not know what to do.
Have you noticed any other changes in the bike operation?

I would not call it a computer error; it could be that something on the bike it out of adjustment like the QS and when the computer does not know what to do it kill the motor. I always had been concerned about having so many techs stuff on a bike.

I could also be related to one of the other features on the bike. My K1200S never did anything like this. So for neither has my K1300S but it does not have many miles
 

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I don't think the QS has anything to do with it. Mine does it very infrequently, and ONLY after decelerating in 1st or 2nd gear and clutching, not when downshifting. I think it's possibly an idle control device issue.
 
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Discussion Starter #9
I'm not seeing a connection to the GS Asst/QS as shutdowns have only occurred while doing nice, easy downshifts at speeds under 30mph approaching a stopping situation. It is has not happened going into 1st as I never downshift to 1st unless I'm going too slow for 2nd and the traffic has just started to move out, thus no need to come to full stop.

I've talked to two dealers and neither have heard such a report, but the S's have really only been available here for a very short period of time. Both thought that there may be an electrical glitch, but the one does admit possibility of computer not accounting for certain situations and just shuts engine down. Anyway, have an appt on May 26 and they'll check it all out and see if there's any code showing. That dealer also told me not to start the bike immediately if at all possible, but wait perhaps 10sec as he says starting the motor immediately may not allow enough time for the code "to be registered/stored". He also said if there is truly a fix patch needed in the software, it'll take months for BMW to get it done. Hah!

This service manager also suggested I note how much fuel was in tank when incidents occurred, past and future. I had considered that and believe the tank was near full in all situations, but just can't be sure. I fill only to bottom of the fill extension.
 

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I too have the QS, but I really don't see that as the culprit here either. It is only supposed to MOMENTARILY shut down the ignition, not anywhere long enough to stop the motor. Besides this happens when downshifting, not upshifting. I also noticed that my tach bounces from about 850 to 1100 rpm at idle, in fast movements, not a slow up and down. Seems like a bad sensor or bad connection somewhere, just putting that out to see if anyone else noticed that and has the stalling happen. I tried the last few rides to make it happen again, but it wouldn't, not that I'm upset or anything. I also thought about the gas level, but tank was at least 3/4 full when it happened. Seems it was pretty common on the 1200s, hope that is NOT the case here!
 

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I've got an 06 K12S. When nearly new (less than 15k miles), it did the same thing, riding around town. Drove me nutz. Went away all by itself and has never come back.

strange... :wtf:
 

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Sheep said:
I'm not seeing a connection to the GS Asst/QS as shutdowns have only occurred while doing nice, easy downshifts at speeds under 30mph approaching a stopping situation. It is has not happened going into 1st as I never downshift to 1st unless I'm going too slow for 2nd and the traffic has just started to move out, thus no need to come to full stop.

I've talked to two dealers and neither have heard such a report, but the S's have really only been available here for a very short period of time. Both thought that there may be an electrical glitch, but the one does admit possibility of computer not accounting for certain situations and just shuts engine down. Anyway, have an appt on May 26 and they'll check it all out and see if there's any code showing. That dealer also told me not to start the bike immediately if at all possible, but wait perhaps 10sec as he says starting the motor immediately may not allow enough time for the code "to be registered/stored". He also said if there is truly a fix patch needed in the software, it'll take months for BMW to get it done. Hah!

This service manager also suggested I note how much fuel was in tank when incidents occurred, past and future. I had considered that and believe the tank was near full in all situations, but just can't be sure. I fill only to bottom of the fill extension.
Now Listen to what I have said,

A switch has a bounce, just about all switches have a bounce, the idea in digital electronics is to sample the " take a look at the switch" switch after it has completed it's bounce, you could sample it to soon and it would go from on to off even though the final state is on. So when you down shift it is possible that down shifting is causing the switch in the shifter to bounce even though it you don't think of it working that direction.

A switch like a a toggle with has a bounce after you switching it on and it may bounce several times. A key board if you rap it hard enough will cause a key to bounce, you never see that key bounce because a chip samples it and the bounce is to short in duration to be valid.

I only know these things from 25 years of electronic engineering. Now this is only a guess but I can guarantee you that switches do bounce and it you're sampling period is too or at the wrong time and error will can occur. I can give you more examples but there no point.

So this may not be the issue at all but something abnormal is causing the motor to die.
I believe the majority of the sensors can fail with killing the motor.
 

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Ok, so even if it is switch "bounce" as you say, why would it completely kill the motor, instead of just momentarily killing it like the QS does? Seems like it would re-read the switch position again a few microseconds later and tell the engine to resume operation. I just want to get it resolved, and hope BMW steps up and admits there is a problem here. The switch thing is tolerable until they get re-designed switches or find out why the early ones weren't reliable, but stalling is a safety issue, not something to be taken lightly, even if it is related to the quick shifter. ANYBODY out there without a QS have this happen to them? Please post if you did! Also it seems like this was an ongoing issue with the 1200s, and they didn't have quick shift on any of those.
 

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clem21 said:
Ok, so even if it is switch "bounce" as you say, why would it completely kill the motor, instead of just momentarily killing it like the QS does? Seems like it would re-read the switch position again a few microseconds later and tell the engine to resume operation. I just want to get it resolved, and hope BMW steps up and admits there is a problem here. The switch thing is tolerable until they get re-designed switches or find out why the early ones weren't reliable, but stalling is a safety issue, not something to be taken lightly, even if it is related to the quick shifter. ANYBODY out there without a QS have this happen to them? Please post if you did! Also it seems like this was an ongoing issue with the 1200s, and they didn't have quick shift on any of those.
The QS is a guess, heck it could be related to all the crappy switches we're having problems with. Like the Start/Kill switch!
 
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Discussion Starter #15 (Edited)
Another engine cut off yesterday morning (5/17/09). This happened within 3 miles of filling tank (not over-filling), heading down road gradually downshifting, decelerating approaching a light in 3rd, pulling clutch in and Voila, engine off! This seems to be the pattern, happening soon after filling tank. Then I run through entire tank without any issues, until shortly after next fill.

Have informed BMW NA with call to same as Clem listed above, and told the fellow that I'm also reporting this to the NHTSA as it is a real safety concern when traffic is hot on your heals. Still have appt with dealer next Monday.

Just posting publicly everytime this happens from now on so anyone else seeing same thing will have a heads-up.

Quote: jewilson
"The QS is a guess, heck it could be related to all the crappy switches we're having problems with. Like the Start/Kill switch!"

JE...
I'm open to hearing any ideas of possible cause. The only thing with the QS is that I've made some intentional "mistakes" by using it under several conditions and there's never an engine cutoff. But I'll put anything before the dealer techs to see what they think.

It's ridiculous that BMW will invest quite a few hours in certifying mechanics on R bikes, yet only require an additional 2 hours on K-bikes when they're by far the more technological wonders, I've been told!
 

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Got another callback from Thomas at BMW NA today and he is referring the switch part number and revision to a supervisor, No word on the stalling issue yet.
 

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Sheep said:
Another engine cut off yesterday morning (5/17/09). This happened within 3 miles of filling tank (not over-filling), heading down road gradually downshifting, decelerating approaching a light in 3rd, pulling clutch in and Voila, engine off! This seems to be the pattern, happening soon after filling tank. Then I run through entire tank without any issues, until shortly after next fill.

Have informed BMW NA with call to same as Clem listed above, and told the fellow that I'm also reporting this to the NHTSA as it is a real safety concern when traffic is hot on your heals. Still have appt with dealer next Monday.

Just posting publicly everytime this happens from now on so anyone else seeing same thing will have a heads-up.

Quote: jewilson
"The QS is a guess, heck it could be related to all the crappy switches we're having problems with. Like the Start/Kill switch!"

JE...
I'm open to hearing any ideas of possible cause. The only thing with the QS is that I've made some intentional "mistakes" by using it under several conditions and there's never an engine cutoff. But I'll put anything before the dealer techs to see what they think.

It's ridiculous that BMW will invest quite a few hours in certifying mechanics on R bikes, yet only require an additional 2 hours on K-bikes when they're by far the more technological wonders, I've been told!

Have you ridden in the rain? A friend with a new K1300GT rode in the rain and soon after had switch problems. Have you check to see that all you're switches are working correctly.

This is to dangerous for you're dealer ship not to work on the problem ASAP, mine sure will.

It's possible with when the software was burn into memory that has some errors and the check sum was missed, it show not have verified but then it's not American software.
 

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Never rode in the rain, only used the heated grips once, but that seems to be the only thing I have in common with the switch failure people. Word is a revised switch is on the way soon, but so far no word on the stalling. Reported to NHTSA too, to make a larger footprint on this. I know some of the 1200s guys say that stalling was a BIG thing on their bikes so seems like whatever caused it there may be the source here. just guessing though. Have the problem escalated now at BMW NA so we'll see where that goes.
 
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Discussion Starter #19 (Edited)
jewilson said:
Have you ridden in the rain? A friend with a new K1300GT rode in the rain and soon after had switch problems. Have you check to see that all you're switches are working correctly.

This is to dangerous for you're dealer ship not to work on the problem ASAP, mine sure will.

It's possible with when the software was burn into memory that has some errors and the check sum was missed, it show not have verified but then it's not American software.
I've been caught in the rain twice in the last 4 days: today's wasn't much but Sunday's was torrential downpour off/on over period of hour's worth of riding home... the lightning all about was "fun". Anyway, no switch problems yet.

The engine cutoff is a very defined pattern: fill tank up then within 30mi where sooner or later you'll surely have to come to a stop or slow down and downshifting through gears to decel, and it will stall. Fire it up immediately and you'll not have another on that tank of gas. I usually fill at same extremely busy BP/Amoco station which does not have water in fuel problems to my knowledge. I've also filled at other stations, but I think this is my next "test" to only buy gas at another station in town just to be sure.

I'm pretty sure if I could fill at any station and have no reason to downshift or come to stop, it probably wouldn't even stall, like filling up on interstate and then run another 160mi. But can't prove or assume that as I've not been on a long interstate run yet during a trip.

I've reported to purchase dealer (560 mi away in NJ), dealer in Raleigh, NC (nearest dealer to me 150mi away) who I have an appt with for checking on 5/26, BMW NA .... all who say they've never heard of such a thing. Reported to NHTSA yesterday... the clerk there didn't even take all the information correctly, but they send you a copy of complaint to correct any errors and email or fax right back.

That's it for now. I've owned couple German cars and this same kind of crap occurred in them like it does on these bikes... things which really aren't cutting edge tech, just sound electrical design and materials/quality needed. But you're the elec engineer so maybe's there more than I'm seeing...LOL Just need heavy dose of patience and perseverance to see this through 'cause the bike is excellent otherwise.
 

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Just thinking a bit here, but I'm wondering if there could be a connection between the fuel cut-off that happens when the engine is decelerating and clutching at or near the rpm level where the fuel cut-off happens. I'm gonna pay closer attention to when this happens on mine. The engine does NOT seem to stall when I delay clutching until the rpm's are close to idle. Interesting?
 
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