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Discussion Starter #1
Bike has 550 miles on it. Went to start it at work (it was in gear and I did screw around with the clutch tension adjuster) put up the kickstand hit the button and nothing happened.
Made sure it was in neutral, cycled the stand a few times, shut off the ignition for a minute or so turned on the ignition waited for diagnostics to run and hit the button - nothing happened. Plenty of battery power - lights are bright, directionals work, flashers, horn, cycled it like three more times.. nothing.
Called the shop - did what they told me to do (exactly as above) - nothing. MAXBMW truck is on the way to get the bike. Tom the service manager is more pissed off than I am.
OK - went across the street got a sub (italian, pickles and onions) - maybe 15 minutes later got back on the bike told myself to just do what I always do and bingo the bike started.
What I noticed:
When I was hitting the starter and the bike was not responding the fuel level bar on the dash would disappear. I have no idea of the significance of this but I did notice it every time I held in the button (this no longer happens now that things are working normally).
I also believe that in order to truly "reset" the ignition you have to wait 10 or so minutes. Did I read in one of these forums that some auxiliary powered farkles will remain powered for a short time after the ignition is shut off? I told Tom the info I got from SFOSTERS problems about the switches he is checking it out today. Bike goes in Friday am for the oil change. I'll keep you posted
 

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I had nothing added to my bike when all of this occurred. It was bone stock (except for an ezpass transponder which isn't attached to anything).

I haven't had the problem since the right switch assembly was replaced..... yet.

I avoided the Electrical Engineering classes like the plague, so I won't profess to have any idea how that stuff works. If there is some sort of wait period for systems to power down, then the switch, or something attached to it has some sort of circuitry, capacitor or processor, that has a "safety" provision which is misbehaving.

Who said good old fashioned mechanical switches were bad?
 

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I guess BMW never heard the saying don't fix it if it aint broke. There was nothing at all wrong with the old switch gear, and it was distinctively BMW.
 

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To paraphrase a Jeff Goldblum line in some dinosaur movie, "BMW was so busy trying to see if they could do it, that they didn't stop to think whether they should do it."

Okay, I stole it from the July 2009 MCN review of the K1300S. :spank1:

Their old switchgear got attacked for years by the non-German Japanese crowd. Just when Germany adopts the Japanese way, stuff really goes bad.

Now I see the Japanese are showing the German's how to build a single-sided swingarm in their new Honda DN-01 along with some sort of automatic transmission too. No doubt their final drive will last far longer than 10,000 miles, and their switchgear won't break in 500 miles.


Mack
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I had an 08GT for a short time before this bike. I liked the switchgear and the bars much better than on the 13. In fact, that is the only thing that I could complain about. I build nuclear cyclotron facilities for the medical industry. At the end of a very long and complicated process the operator ends up standing in front of a glove box holding mechanical manipulators. I can buy the cheap ones for 12K or the expensive ones for 56K. I always spend the 56K. as this is the only place the operator interfaces with the facility is by holding those manip's. The build quality and the "feel" are worth the money. Everytime I swing my leg over the 13 or hit the directionals I think of those dam manip's.
 

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Cool analogy, thanks.
So sort of like getting in a new S Class Mercedes V12 and being met by a thin hard black plastic steering wheel.......
 

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I noticed that in case the bike died unintentionally in gear - you have to start it in the same gear, just pull the clutch in.

What are your impressions on the two models?
 

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It usually takes me awhile to warm up to BMW design and changes. I'm not so sure about the switch gear. I'm going to miss having a turn signal under each thumb. Oh well, I won't be trading the 2008 in for quite some time so no sense in worrying about it now. I'm sure I'll get used to it but it just won't be BMW like. :(
 

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While it is a valid complaint that the new controls should WORK, having come from other bikes, I can't see any superiority in the BMW signal design. I'm glad they finally bit the bullet, although I'm sure to some it's one of those necessary "Saab key on the floor" sort of things that "must" be there to be a BMW.

I've got a "new" 2008, so it still has the "traditional" controls. I'm getting used to them, but would gladly trade for the new ones (a working set, of course :) ) if I could.

As far as "quality", I agree it's obvious that BMW seems to be having some problems with their particular implementation. But in dozens of years of riding and dozens of bikes (even road racers and dirt bikes) with the "inferior/cheezy" controls, I can honestly say I've never had a control failure.

So, there's nothing inherently wrong with the design.
 

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I wouldn't say that the individual turn signal switches are a traditional BMW thing. My understanding is that they came about with the K Bikes, mid 80's? So the old airhead guys are probably welcoming the change back to the mono-switch, that is if they are putting these on everything, and the old airhead guy will even buy a new bike.
But to a guy like me in particular, who got in to BMW with the K Bike, it's not really a welcome change and seems a big break with tradition. Only for a K Bike guy, or someone who has only been in to BMWs for 20 yrs or so does it seem that way. IMO
Gilly
 

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I test road a new 2009 K1300S and love the new switchgear. I was going to take their K1300GT out for a spin but it was down and waiting for new switchgear. :) The dealer was very open about the switchgear problem and explained that BMW was doing good on getting replacements out. In fact, the dealer called me yesterday and told me their K1300GT demo was fixed and ready to go whenever I wanted to go for a test ride.

I am looking forward to it. Really enjoyed the K1300S demo.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Agree my Saab's key on the floor was cool and I really liked the car but it got broken into so many times the dashboard started to pull out from the mounts! Should have got an alarm (1982). Oh well sorry to see they are in so much trouble.
I am waiting for the day I get on the 13 and think the controls are "cool" like the 12.
I was asked what I think of the 13 vs the 12. I had a really nice 12..(a good one)
A) Like the color better Bronze vs Blue
B) The 13 acts in 5th like the 12 does in fourth without the throttle torque. The 13 is more of a "cruiser". Let's face it the 12 is not a forgiving bike to ride around town. Having both I appreciate the 13 but I liked the 12! I think for new folks looking for a sport tourer the 13 is more of what they would think of. I know when I started driving the 12 I wasn't thinking "touring bike" I was thinking rocketship with precise handling and very close engine response. Off the git the clutch on the 13 is smoother than the 12 for sure. Transmission is less clunky but not hugely so. It still clunks...
C) I like the instrument shroud better on the 13
D) 12 controls are much better
E) 12 always started regardless of my luncheon plans
F) If the 13 is faster it would take more than my 30 years in the saddle to figure out how.
 

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Besides the faulty switchgear :), I can't think of anything the K12 does better than the K13. The side vents and even the new reservoirs don't bother me at all, but the K13 simply fixes all the niggling little issues with the K12. And the biggest improvement is that the fueling is now spot on. No dips, no hesitation, no dropping out at idle, nothing but smooth, quick power. As it should have been back in 2005/2006 . . .
 

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"biggest improvement is that the fueling is now spot on. No dips, no hesitation, no dropping out at idle, nothing but smooth, quick power. As it should have been back in 2005/2006 . . "

I wonder how much of the improvement is due to software? And whether we will ever see those developments released for the K12?
 

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Paul_C said:
I wonder how much of the improvement is due to software? And whether we will ever see those developments released for the K12?
Nope, not gonna happen. Basically, BMW went to Ricardo, a well-known tuning house and let them completely redesign the top end of the Slant/4 engine. So none of the changes are easily retrofittable to the K12 without swapping out the entire engine (at which point you might as well just trade up for a K13).

See this thread and specifically this post for details.

However, there is hope for us K12 riders. Make sure you have the latest air box and software updates from BMW, put in a new O2 sensor, and install a Power FRK unit. The hesitation, flat spots, and stalling simply disappear, and the bike runs as it should have from the factory.

See this thread, this thread, and this thread for more details.

But the bottom line is that it just plain works.
 

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grifscoots said:
How is your fueling these days? When we did our leetle run, I noticed you using regular and was wondering if it made a difference.
Feels great so far. I might need to put 10 or 20 thousand miles on it to be sure :), but it's a huge improvement.
 

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Seems my '06 was acting up and even stalling dead for the first time in traffic. In Minden, NV I had to pull over as then thing's RPM suddenly dropped to 0 RPM and silence. Knew I had gas. It restarted okay, but then rapidly went to 0 RPM and I sat there in traffic again. After the 5th try, I held the throttle open to 2K RPM and was on my way on the highway. Puzzling.

However, prior to that the BBS and 3100 RPM idle reared its ugly head when I got off the freeway for the first stop in 200 miles. I thought, "The BBS and High Idle crap is back...." and after Ventura BMW fixed it in 8-2007. Not that hot out, maybe 74 degrees. Yellow light came on at the 216 mile mark before I began looking for a gas station.

The Sparks, NV dealer (Sierra BMW) ran the bike's VIN and it showed the airbox replacements began in 12-2007. Mine must be the sanded version (8-2007) which lasted about 12K miles. Also, had a recall on the centerstand on their computer as well. Scott, their service manager said I should get the new airbox along with the newest software upgrade.

He also hasn't seen the insides of the new K1300 final drive to say anything has changed. Mostly, they just change them outright as a core back to BMW. Getting most of the stuff overnight from BMW is an extra charge to the dealer if they get the order out by 3PM.

So into Chico it goes on Tuesday morning (scehduled) for the Valve Service notice off the GS-911 and the brake fluid flush thing on the servos. Airbox? Who knows.

Crap. :(


Mack
 
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